Welcome to Digication
Scholars Conversations.

I'm your host, Jeff Yan.

In this episode, you will hear part
two of my conversation with Kate Sonka,

Executive Director of Teach Access.

More links and information about today's
conversation can be found on Digication's

Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram.

Full episodes of Digication Scholars
Conversations can be found on

YouTube or your favorite podcast app.

Let me ask you something.

Now, I, I know that we have
talked about this already.

You had talked about, um,
public universities as spaces,

um, as public spaces, etc.

Now you actually also have been involved
in higher education for a number of years.

That's true.

That is correct.

Um, obviously you, you, you know, um,
I know, you know, as both, you know,

a student, but then also, um, you
know, had, uh, you had the, I believe

that you are the Assistant Director
of Inclusion and Academic Technology.

That's right.

Yep.

Yeah.

And this is at Michigan State
University, is that right?

Yep.

Yeah.

And prior to that, you were at, um,
DePaul University, which is where,

so this is, I think one of those
funny, um, just like universe moments.

I don't know what to call it,
where, so there was a time when I

was working on my master's degree
at DePaul University in Chicago.

Um, I was working in the academic tech
office or educational technology office

there within the college of education.

And at that time, there were several Uh,
faculty and other, um, others outside

in the College of Ed and outside of
the College of Ed at DePaul who were

using Digication, um, and who were
introducing it in their courses, um,

and right as I was leaving, um, there
was some use of it for, um, some of

the Uh, teacher certification and I've,
the, it has escaped me now exactly

what it was, but so I was working
with Digication both as a student,

submitting materials and using it.

I mean, this was like
more than a decade ago.

And then when I graduated and I
was working in the EdTech office

there, um, supporting faculty.

and students who are using Digication.

And so I, I mean at the time I'm like,
this is a great tool, I love this.

Um, and then went to MSU, Michigan State
University, and there were a few people on

campus using Digication, um, and then it
just, it wasn't something that I spent too

much time with, but, uh, then it was very,
Very funny, I guess is the word, or just

one of those moments, um, because it was
Mark Thompson who we mentioned earlier,

um, I think who sent an email and just
said, Hey, you two should know each other.

And I just, I was like, this is so funny.

I already know who Jeff is.

I know what Digication is.

I've worked with it.

Uh, and so, yeah, it's, uh,
been a great, a great tool.

I've, I've really loved watching it
grow too, kind of as a, an insider

at first, but now, you know, being a
partner, of course, but, um, yeah, so

it's just, it's a funny, the world is
funny, you know, all these things happen.

I love these, um, these many
overlapping circles that we have.

Yes.

And I, I think that there
is, I don't know, for me,

sometimes the world has a f...

humorous way of, of, of putting, um,
people with similar interests, you know,

together, it's almost like, um, you
know, some, some invisible rules and laws

and forces that said, right, you guys,
uh, you know, interested in this thing.

And it's almost like people were
interested in music or sports or

arts or whatever, you know, and it's
like you find each other, right?

So, um, I think that, Unfortunately,
the accessibility circle seems

it's growing, of course, but it's
small enough that we were able to,

you know, have all these overlaps.

Uh, but that's also, also very
fortunate because I got to see all

of your good work over the years
and it's pretty, pretty amazing.

Um, and I, I love, I still
remember, you know, our very first.

No, I guess it's not our first
meeting, but, well, our...

Our first meeting with you being the
executive director of Teach Access and

you're like, you know, we know each other.

I mean, to be fair, Jeff, to be fair,
I wasn't, I think we were probably in

maybe one or two meetings where we, you
know, but it was a group of people and

there were, um, some colleagues, some
great colleagues of mine who are, who are

still working at DePaul, wonderful people
who were working with you more often.

So, yeah.

In no way did I expect
that you would remem...

you would have remembered me specifically,
but you know, it was sort of those group

meeting situations, but it was, yeah.

It was funny.

Oh, it's really fantastic.

And I will say that, you know, our,
our own journey, um, I'd imagine that

when we were working, when you were
at DePaul, which would have been,

you know, it was like 2009 to 2014.

So it's early enough that, um,
whatever accessibility work that

we did back then was minimal.

Like we just were not aware or are, I
mean, look, people are sort of aware,

but like, you know, we, we just didn't
have to know what all the, don't know

how, um, the community wasn't really
matured enough, we couldn't agree on

some, you know, on things and there
was a lot, I still remember there were

a lot of, um, sort of things like.

It's definitely a nice to have because
by the time it gets to like implementing

it, everyone does it differently.

And then it doesn't kind of work.

And, and, and, and the, I still
remember my first exposure to,

um, it was, um, Screen Reader.

So for people who don't know what screen
reader is, right, A Screen Reader is,

um, usually an Assistive technology
that exists on your, you know, as a

piece of software or in your operating
system, on your phone, on your computer,

where it tries to read out, you know,
what's on the screen for someone who

might be visually impaired, right?

And I still remember at the time, um,
the, Only screen reader or the only

like usable screen reader was JAWS.

And that, um, I still remember that it
ran on windows and that, uh, windows

only, and that it's for people's
general experience is that every, uh,

I don't know, every 10-15 minutes.

They have to restart the operating
system because it actually

crashes and doesn't work.

But now we have to remember, this
is not JAWS's fault necessarily.

We have to remember back.

Like if we push back many years ago
on our computer, hardware isn't there.

Think about like speech
to text technology, right?

That theory didn't exist.

We were not used to the current
fidelity of things, right?

So as technology becomes better
and better, in fact, many of

the big tech companies are
the one that pushed it, right?

Like I think Siri and maybe even
Alexa created a computer generated

speech experience that we can be like.

I could live with it and now AI actually
had made it even like now it's a little

bit, you know, in fact, scary, right?

Um, but, but, but, but it's, it was
something that we really could live with.

We can say, yeah, I could listen to this
in general and, and, and can see that

that technology can really become matured.

But back in the days it was hard, which
is why I think that there's a, this

catch up, you know, sort of period.

Um, I just hope that it doesn't.

Take too long for the catch
up to happen, you know?

Yeah.

Yeah, I agree.

Um, so speaking of, um, uh, the, your
experience with education, I wanted to

just say how thankful I am because of
your Active participation in understanding

the experiences of students and teachers.

Yes.

We were able to really quickly, and
you helped us, helped Digication

create a set of guides for
students and for faculty members.

It's a self serve, really easy to
consume, really quick, just in time,

where we have made the decision to
include all the information now into,

um, the most, into our most prominent
real estate, you know, in our digital

space, which is everywhere that a student
might be creating any kind of work,

they will see a button on accessibility
and it will include the guide that

we partnered on and created together.

Thank you so much for doing that.

That is just...

Oh my gosh, I need to be
thanking you, yeah, yeah.

Thanking you and your whole
team for, for doing that.

Because I think what it demonstrates
is, you know, I think we've said

the word easy a couple of times,
or, um, you know, There are, sure,

there are things about accessibility
and digital accessibility that are

not easy, that are very challenging.

But generally speaking, there are a lot
of things we can do to make our content

more accessible, including students
who are publishing their portfolios,

um, including faculty who are preparing
their students to publish their

portfolios that really make a difference.

And, and I also, you know,
one of the things we often

say too is start somewhere.

Just get started.

No, you're not going to
be an expert tomorrow.

You may never be an expert.

Um, you may never want to be an expert,
but, but get started, do something.

And I think, you know, earlier
you were mentioning as someone

who, you know, hires, is hiring
people are looking for that.

I mean, as students are putting their
work out there, being able to demonstrate,

hey, I know what accessibility is,
generally speaking, and I have done a

couple of things to my portfolio to make
it more accessible, that indicates a lot.

You know, they're thinking
about inclusivity.

They're thinking about the different
ways they're presenting their

materials, um, and their artifacts,
uh, and, and their work to the world.

Um, there are other pieces around
accessibility that also include

or also improve things like Search
Engine Optimization, like when we're

talking about Alt Text, so there's a
lot that adding accessibility, um, is

good for all of those things, right?

That's sort of that other bucket of stuff.

This is great.

But also more importantly, it's
creating something that is accessible

for people with disabilities.

So, you know, the hiring manager who
may have a disability or, um, whoever,

whoever, whoever it is that you're
trying to reach with your work, you

want to get it out there and you
want to share it, make it accessible.

And, and I, so I really am so grateful to
all of you at Digication for recognizing

that and, and really building that in.

Because it also kind of helps
students understand that it isn't

a whole big, extra big thing.

That's going to take all your time.

Hey, you're getting ready to publish.

Here's the little checklist.

I know that that's probably not what
you're exactly calling it, but here

are the steps to get ready to publish.

Did you check this?

Did you check this?

Did you check this?

Accessibility is one in a number of
things, which also really speaks to

what we're trying to do, which is
really, um, um, You know, ubiquitous

is a big word, but so in trying to
think in plain language here, you

know, really make it something that
appears alongside everything else.

It becomes a very typical
thing that I expect to do when

I'm about to publish my work.

I'm going to check on this thing.

I'm going to check on this thing.

One of them is about accessibility.

One of them is not.

But they're all together because it's
all equally important for me to do

these things before I publish my work.

And so, I mean, a big thank you to you all
for recognizing that and being able to add

that, um, and put that into the platform.

It's, it's phenomenal.

It's great.

Well, I, I wanted to say that Obviously,
accessibility itself is, you know,

like, I think we all agree, you and
I agree, and many people agree that

it's, it's, it just becomes part of
our literacy, becomes part of everyday

life, and we need to honor that.

But I also wanted to say that
there is, you know, for those who

are more into, like, you know,
listeners who are teachers, who are

faculty members, who are thinking,
well, you know, I teach, Biology.

I teach whatever.

Like, how does that relate to me?

Aside from, I already know about the,
I need to be able to help any of my

students who might have disabilities, etc.

You know, to consume my
content and communication, etc.

But I also think there is some
deeper pedagogical, um, connections

that I wanted to make here.

So, for example, we have talked
a bit about Alt Text today.

Alt Text is, you know, when you put up
an image somewhere, you want Someone

who are visual, who's visually impaired,
who can still be able to enjoy that,

be able to consume that by you being
able to put up oftentimes a small and

concise description or a caption, um,
that talks about what it is, right?

That you, you've put up, um, and...

Interestingly, um, I had done some
experiment with users in general, right?

And we started talking about,
well, what's good Alt Text?

What's not?

And, you know, and people can get,
you can get, you can nerd out on

that itself, which is for sure.

Funny sometimes, right?

But it's all in the name of like
learning and gaining, gaining experience.

Sometimes you just have to, right?

Are you, you know, are you, are you
focusing on a flower in the middle of room

or the fact that you're in a room, right?

So you're, you're, you're trying
to figure all that out, you know,

what's important, but that in and
of itself is what I'm talking about.

There is some pedagogical value to,
if I am trying to express myself, I

put up a page in Digication, or it
doesn't matter as a Digication, it's,

it's, you know, you're doing a project,
you're trying to put a piece of visual

media to, to help represent yourself
or your ideas or the concept, right?

Maybe it's a very poetic, you
know, sort of, you know, analogy.

Maybe it's a, just a busy background.

We don't know yet.

When you actually make that.

I find that when you actually
make that Alt Text, when you

start to write, well, what is it?

It actually helps you both try to
figure out, well, sometimes you put

up something, you don't even know why,
you just kind of throw it up there,

almost like, you know, some putting
some background image together, right?

And just to set the mood,
maybe that's what it is.

And that's, you need to
acknowledge that and know that.

And then there are times where you go.

Oh, this is really meaningful to
me because I'm trying to tell a

story of, I don't know, immigrants.

And this is actually a photo
of my grandparents coming to

this country or what have you.

And that meaning can be so powerful.

But if you didn't get to, almost in this
case, highly encouraged, if ....., You

know, really like asking you, like, Hey,
please put, put in a description here.

Now you, you got to think
about it a little bit more.

You start to make a, huh?

You know what, now that I've written that
I've even had the experience where I wrote

the description for the first image and I
go, I have another one that's like this.

I should add to it.

Right.

So there is a direct pedagogical.

Set of innovation that you can do
with your students and the nuance,

like experience of having to think
deeply about how you are treating your

own content that you are, you know,
producing and curating and creating.

Is a, is a, is a wonderful way to think
more deeply about, you know, how you

reflect on your own learning and integrate
with the different aspects of life.

And I just think that, again, you
know, in this case, it's not like only

accessibility is good for business.

This is actually, accessibility is good
for learning too, for the individuals

who are just writing up what would
have been otherwise a paper, right?

I love this.

I'm in, I'm in agreement with you.

One of the things, so when I was
working at Michigan State University,

um, and working in accessibility
there, it was around supporting, you

know, this teaching accessibly piece.

So thinking about what do we need to
do to create inclusive and accessi...,

accessible, um, classrooms, um, materials,
uh, and supporting faculty and doing that.

And what you're talking about reminds
me sometimes the conversation we would

have around Alt Text, since we're on that
topic, you know, Yes, sometimes I was

just throwing on, throwing up an image.

I don't know.

It's just a, it's a good image and there
was also a, I'm going to just put this

image up and I'm going, you know, as a,
as a instructor, um, I'm going to, um,

assume that, um, When Jeff sees that
image, he'll know what I intended with it.

You know, aside from the choosing
the image side and the intentionality

behind what am I trying to convey?

It was also, I mean, this came up a
lot and, and it really helped inform

my thinking around accessibility as
well as a pedagogical move, um, was,

okay, well, I put up this, this image
and I assume, or my expectation is

that all my students will see it on
my slide deck and they'll know that

that's what I mean, or that that's
what they should get out of this image.

Or graph or whatever.

Um, but as it turns out, Jeff is in my
classroom and he looks at the image and he

thinks about something else because of his
Lived Experience or, you know, where he's

just, whatever it is, he's in a different,
he's having a different sort of day.

And so he sees it and he thinks something.

Right.

So then what's happened is that I let
an image do a lot of work and maybe I

didn't spend time describing that image
in class, or maybe it's something in a

You're going to get something different
out of it than maybe others in the class.

And maybe that's the right thing.

Maybe that's the wrong thing.

However, we want to classify it.

Um, and so when we think about Alt Text,
uh, in this way, it helps us think about,

okay, why are we choosing this image?

And what we often saw kind of
building off of this is, you know, a

faculty member might choose an image
and start typing out the Alt Text.

And now all of a sudden we have
two paragraphs as the Alt Text.

And it's like, well, hold on a second.

If.

If you, you know, if you're using
this image to convey that much

information, it probably means
this image is very important to

understanding of whatever the concept is.

So let's consider how you can take that
two paragraph Alt Text, which is way

too long, and put it into your slide
deck or put it into your discussion for

the class or put it into your text or
whatever it might be so that the image

is still there, of course, but you have
become a more explicit instructor to

say, hey everybody, look at this image.

You might see this, this, and this
in there, and here's why this is

significant to what we're talking about.

And so I think there, that is a phenomenal
way that accessibility really can be

sort of this feedback loop for us as
instructors and educators to think,

okay, if I need to spend one second
thinking about what I'm about to share

with my students, let me actually
spend that one second thinking about.

Why am I doing that?

Let me reflect on it.

And if I'm assuming or expecting that it's
going to do all this heavy lifting and I

haven't been explicit with my students,
chances are very good someone will miss

that because for so many reasons, right?

So I think your example is so great.

Um, and I, I definitely agree.

Uh, it's, it's an important piece of it.

Um, I, I think that it would be Really
useful for folks to learn about some of

the resources that Teach Access has that
is not necessarily going to be part of

what they will see on the Digication,
you know, sort of interface because

Teach Access is a lot more deeper set
of resources than what, you know, we

have included in the, in, in, in, on,
on our, you know, in our product page.

Um, so, um, I, I, I'm going to jump, you
know, give you a jump off point because

I think that these are things that I,
I've seen and I just love them so much.

You have, for example, opportunities
for faculty members to get

involved, further involved.

So meaning those ones that are
saying, Hey, this, I've, I've been

exposed to it now, but I want more.

I want to rethink help with...

get some help thinking about
my curriculum, thinking

about my whole course.

Can I get help?

And I know that you provide that
and I want you to talk about it.

Similarly, students can, you
know, can, can get resources.

Um, can we talk about that?

Because I think that there
will be people, right?

Whether it be people who listen
to this and go, you know what?

I should check this out.

Right.

Um, or that they saw our, you
know, you know, sort of, uh, our

experience, you know, through, you
know, building something in Digication

and they go, Oh, well, what is this?

Can I learn more?

Can you tell, tell us a little bit
more now about like, what's, what's,

what are some of the top resources
that you recommend people check out?

Love that.

Thank you for this question.

And I do hope people
come and check it out.

So, um, Some of the top resources
that we have, um, for faculty who are

ready or would like to think about,
okay, I'm ready to be teaching this.

Um, we have something called the Teach
Access Curriculum Repository and it's

a free open educational resource or OER
repository with more than 350, I think,

at this point, different individual
curricular items that are divided into a

dozen or so different discipline areas.

Um, and these are all under a Creative
Commons license so that you are free as an

educator to go in there, take, and adapt
for your own class and your own teaching.

Um, but it's a variety of things.

Sample syllabi, um, uh, slide decks,
assignment prompts, um, discussion

posts, et cetera, that you can go and
take and adapt and put into your course.

They've been created by other educators
who have used them in their courses.

And so the idea is that, hey, I'm
ready to teach, or I want to look at

some materials and see how I can add
this to a course I'm already teaching.

So that's out there, free and open.

Along those lines, we have some self
guided or self paced asynchronous courses.

Again, in some discipline topics
that if you're like, I'm wanting to

do this, but I'd like a little more
information for myself, you can go in

and learn about your discipline area and
accessibility to help set you up for that.

And then we have a few other programs,
um, that are more kind of hybrid, um,

or, or fully synchronous virtual, of
course, all of them right now, uh,

where you can be in community in a
cohort, um, with other professors

from across the U S other educators
who are looking to also be teaching.

And so we pull from those two pieces
I talked about the repository and

the, um, the self paced courses.

Um, but.

We work together with faculty
to, to work through what is this?

What is it gonna look like to teach it?

Um, and, and a little bit set
them up to become advocates.

So, okay, go to your campus
and tell your colleagues.

Go to that conference
and tell your colleagues.

Um, so that's really sort of the...

the highlights for, um, that and I
should note very importantly, um, some

of them, we actually provide stipends,
um, for faculty to participate.

So we provide you funding to
be able to do this as well.

Um, recognizing time is important and
when we want to honor that, um, and same.

On the student side, not, not same
as in we're providing funding for

students, but um, right now we have some
virtual offerings where students can

hear directly from industry partners.

Um, they can hear directly from
other faculty, uh, accessibility

experts, as well as disability,
um, non profit, um, advocates.

And so there are programs where
Someone from a company will come

in and talk about, Hey, here's what
accessibility looks like at this company.

Um, here's what my job looks like.

Um, here's an interesting topic around
accessibility or disability that we're

going to talk about that I do in my work.

Um, and so it's really a space where
students can hear directly from people

who are doing this work right now.

Um, and obviously build their network.

Um, and so think about building
their network with each other.

They're future colleagues, right, who
are in school with them right now.

Um, but also the people that they'll
want to connect with in companies

they go work for or in general.

So, um, the other thing
is everything is free.

So all of the things I've talked about,
anything you find on our website is free.

Um, we don't charge for people to
be able to access these things.

Um, don't want to add that extra
barrier, um, for people to be

able to, to get this information.

So, yes.

And how, how do you provide
these things for free?

Um, you know, how, um, how does,
um, how, how is Teach Access funded?

Yeah, great question.

So, um, as a non profit, we're funded
in ways that many non profits are.

So, so we do get funding, um,
sponsorship from companies, industry.

Um, so they'll provide sponsorship for us.

Um, we also, of course, accept
Donations from people who are

excited about our cause and are
in a position to be able to give.

Um, so we have individual donors,
um, and then we're working

on different types of grants.

Um, you know, for example, in
NSF funding, we're working with

some faculty, hopefully, uh, on
different ways that we can do this

work, um, in, within those grants.

Um, so other types of federal
grants, um, and then of course

foundations and those sorts of things.

So.

Yes, it's a, it's a mix.

So if any listeners here today, um,
identifies with Kate's and her team's

mission, um, on, you know, these ways
of, she's already done so much, you know,

with, with, you know, you know, with
so little and being able to, you know,

provide all these resources to the world.

Um, And, and I think that we can all
see it's just a really smart way by

design because you are getting faculty
members and teachers to be get involved

and they are the ones who is going to
then, you know, one of them may, may,

may on an annual basis, you know, come
across a couple hundred students or

something more and imagine the kind of
Um, exponential reach that you can have.

So for every dollar that you donate,
for every dollar that you support this

organization, it gets used so well.

Then this is why I love
this organization so much.

And I also want to say that
for those who are employers.

There's one resource that
I've looked at and I love.

And do you want to talk about it?

The tool kit?

Yeah, is it the hiring tool kit?

I'm guessing.

Yeah, I know it's so, so, um, I'll
give a little, I know we're probably

nearing time here, but, um, you
know, when we think about the work

we do, we really are thinking about,
you know, the educational approach.

We're thinking about supporting
faculty, um, curriculum design,

development, et cetera, and students.

Um, so we aren't necessarily sort
of strictly a workforce development

organization, although we're
part of that conversation, right?

Because what we're doing is trying to
close that gap we were talking about.

And so recognizing that, we thought,
you know, all right, so we're working

with faculty, they're excited, they're
teaching hundreds of students, students

are getting excited, they're getting
ready to go out and look for jobs.

And how do we create a space
where students can Find and

identify organizations that
are looking for their skills.

And so we've created something
called the Accessibility

Technology Skills Hiring Toolkit.

Again, free resource, uh,
created together with educators,

industry, disability groups.

And the idea behind this is that you, if
you are in any sort of hiring position.

An HR manager, or just, you,
you, you write job descriptions.

You can go here.

I think right now we have around a
dozen sort of, um, what I'll call

sort of generic, uh, job descriptions.

You know, Product Manager,
Front-end Designer, etc.

Um, and we have, uh, several different,
bulleted lists items that you can

copy and paste into your own job
descriptions that indicate here's,

you know, we're hiring a Front-end...

entry-level Front-end Developer,
here's the stuff we would love for that

person to know about accessibility.

Um, not again, not an expert.

This is not an accessibility
specific role, but just we'd like

them to know that the web content
accessibility guidelines exist.

We'd like them to know
whatever that might be.

Um, so you can copy and paste.

Right into your own job descriptions.

And then we've also provided
some sample interview questions.

So recognizing sometimes the person
who's written the job description

or, you know, the team that this,
this employee might go on to, isn't

necessarily who's doing the interviewing.

There's a hiring manager
or an interviewer.

Um, and so providing some questions
to help ask Hey, do you actually

know what the, what WCAG is?

Where would you go to find it?

You know, some, some,
some ways to help prepare.

This is the answer we're looking for.

Just interviewing with me,
and if he says something along

these lines, that's a thumbs up.

That means he knows whatever it is
that I'm trying to screen for, um,

when it comes to accessibility skills.

So, it's, we continue to add to it.

So this is one way people can contribute.

Um, we, we are always looking for
more people if they're like, Hey, I

often hire for this type of job and
this would be great if people had this

entry level knowledge, we welcome that.

Um, we want to make sure that
this resource is something

that is relevant and usable.

Um, so.

If you're interested, let us know.

We'd love to be able to bring you
in and have you help and volunteer

with creating that resource
or building the resource out.

Um, I, I love that.

I think that it's, it's just
wonderful that you are thinking

about all the different, You know,
different components that goes into,

into, into the ecosystem, right?

And, and all of the people that are
involved and you are so smart and trying

to get them to, to be able to, you know,
provide the resources that can be reused

over and over again, and ultimately
just powering them, making them, um,

You know, have the, have the, have the
ability to develop all of those, those,

those, those literacies, literacy skills.

You know, we, we already
talked about students.

We talked about, you know, the educators.

Now we're talking about the
employers as well, right?

So, you know, you're going to
reach more and more of this.

And for those who are, um,
faculty members and careers

people, you're listening to this.

I'll tell you like my, like when, when I
saw this first hiring, you know, toolkit,

my first thought was, wow, that would be a
really cool backward design hack by seeing

what questions, you know, like, you know,
like the industry is going to end up.

Asking of our students and being able
to go, are we teaching these things at

school or are we setting our students
up to fail because they're going to

go into these meetings and they're
going to ask them these questions

and they're going to, you know, be
like, wait, what are we talking about?

Right.

And so, um, And I'm not saying
specifically like teach the

test, but you need to figure
out where the world is going.

And I think that this is sort of, you
can see the tea leaves now, like, Kate,

you've, you've sort of laid it out.

And, and I think people, you know,
need to now go in and recognize them.

Well, Hey, listen, I know that we
can, we can talk for a lot longer.

Cause I feel like that we
have in other occasions, but.

Um, I, I, um, I really, really
appreciate you sharing your insights.

I think that your passion to
accessibility is infectious.

Um, and, um, and your organization
is doing such amazing work.

I am so, so proud to be able to
call you a partner and a friend.

And I, I really look forward to
our continuing, um, collaboration.

And, um, for anyone who is also
interested in Kate's and her team's work,

please go check out TeachAccess.org.

We will list a bunch of those
resources that she mentioned in

the, in the, in the show notes.

But you know how, you know, a, a di
highly dynamic organization like this will

constantly have new resources, et cetera.

So following them on the, on social
media and checking out their website,

looking for their news would be
a, would be a good way to go.

Uh, Kate also appears often at various
conferences, um, and, and, and, and,

and public, um, you know, events.

And so look out for her.

Um.

If you enjoyed listening to her today
here on Digication Scholars Conversations.

Yes, thank you so much, Jeff.

Thank you for having us, uh, us
meeting the larger Teach Access.

I know it was just me today
and my cat in the background.

There is a cat here.

Uh, for those who aren't watching
on, on, um, on the video,

there is a cat joining us.

Uh, but yeah, thank you so much
for, for making the space for

us, um, to partner with you.

We.

We're so thrilled about it.

And yeah, happy to, to anyone who
wants to reach out, learn more.

We really encourage that.

Okay.

All right.

Well, take care of Kate
and talk to you soon.

Thanks Jeff.

Bye.

Coming up next, we'll be chatting
with Brittany Linus, a recent

graduate of Stanford University.

Here's a quick preview.

I was just perusing the homepage and I was
just like, of course, every website, every

school is going to have short, concise
information and all the beautiful pictures

of the campus and then in the classroom.

I'm looking forward to it.

for the dirty stuff.

I'm looking for what is going on in
the maker spaces, the artist spaces.

I want to know really what
Stanford is all about.

Um, and that's when I discovered
Stanford University's Design School.

And I remembered on literally on
the website, scroll down, it said,

We are here to get stuff done
and to get stuff done creatively.