Welcome to Digication
Scholars Conversations.

I'm your host, Jeff Yan.

In this episode, you will hear part one of
my conversation with Lizz Colon, Director

of Learning in Public at College Unbound.

More links and information about today's
conversation can be found on Digication's

Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram.

Full episodes of Digication Scholars
Conversations can be found on

YouTube or your favorite podcast app.

Welcome to Digication
Scholars Conversations.

I'm your host, Jeff Yan.

My guest today is Lizz Cologne, Director
of Learning in Public at College Unbound.

Hi, Lizz.

Hi, how are you?

Good.

I have been a massive fan of
College Unbound for a very

long time, since its inception.

I have, uh, been friends with your,
um, Uh, current president, Adam

Bush, uh, for over a decade when he
co founded, uh, College of God with

Dennis Littky, uh, whom I've also
admired for another decade before that.

In fact, Adam, Adam Bush was a
Digitation Scholars, um, back in

season one, episode 25 and 26.

So people should check them
out if, um, this story, you

know, um, resonates with you.

Um, so Lizz, um, why don't you tell
us a little bit about College Unbound,

uh, for those who may not be aware,
um, of what it is and, you know,

how is it different from others?

Colleges, and the fact that it's,
it's a college, it's a degree

granting college and some people
don't even know about that.

Right?

So go ahead and tell us a little
bit about College Unbound.

So College Unbound, uh,
started about 15 years ago.

Um, in 2020, we actually
got our, uh, accreditation.

Uh, through NECHE.

And, um, they're the consortium
that, that accreditates, uh,

all New England colleges.

Um, and, um, we have been able
to build a, um, rigorous program,

which is a bit untraditional.

Um, we're not like other colleges in a
way that, you know, it is, here's a book.

Read the information,
take a test, and move on.

We really have a commitment to
our students who have had, um,

a lot of, uh, educational trauma
in a lot of different ways.

Um, you know, being lack of schools or
overcrowded schools, thinking about,

um, the level of diversity, poverty, you
know, all of those things that we look at.

Um, You know, we are the, uh, the
college that really serves people.

Who are not going to do that
mainstream traditional path.

And so we, uh, have, uh, created a
process to embrace the fact that as an

adult, you can go to college, you can
handle a full time, um, level of, of.

You know, full time courses, um, you
can work full time, you can raise

your family, and believe it or not,
with all of that in the mix, you can

still have time for self care, right?

And it is so important.

Um, so we've been able to, uh, create and
model this program into a way where we

really care deeply about our community.

And because we're passionate about
our community, um, there are three

ways that students can learn.

Go through College Unbound.

One, each student has to have a project
and it's a project that they care about.

It's a project that can be,
um, can be, you know, as large

as this 5 year scale project.

It can be a fundraiser.

It really could be anything that,
um, can That you are passionate

and that you care about.

And with that beco comes community impact.

So we do a lot of asset mapping.

We do a lot of, um, working with the
students to figure out what is your plan?

What is your goal?

What are your passions?

Um, how would you impact this community?

Uh, what are the different types of steps
that you would take to be able to do this?

Or if you were to build a
business or create a nonprofit.

Um, and these are all,
uh, things that we want.

And we get from people who are, um,
coming back into college that have

been either out for a very long time
or never had the opportunity before.

Um, a couple of ways that we do this
is one, um, College Unbound is, uh,

takes, uh, Any type of credit you
might have from a previous institution.

So it could have been military credit.

It could have been credit through
credentialing services like ACE.

It could be, um, that you have, you
know, you went to college years ago

and that college, you know, your
transfer, uh, credit will come in.

And so people are coming in
in multiple different ways.

And so everybody starts
the same type of process.

Um, although no matter how much
credit you come in with, um, you

still have to The first semester is
the only semester we kind of dictate.

Um, and the reason for that is because
we want to be able to set people up, um,

with the right supports that everybody
is starting at the same foundation.

Even though you might come in with
different credits and you might

come in with different skills.

Um, this really sets you up because
we do things in a different way.

It's not about just, you know, um,
reading, taking a test and moving on.

It is really sitting with.

And learning about how we
process reflective learning.

And so because of that, you really
have to sit in the mix with this.

It's not just an easy one, two,
three, um, way of doing things.

Uh, it's a little unique.

We have this really, um, We call it the
secret sauce, uh, can't tell you exactly

what it is because I think there are a
little bit of there are pieces throughout

and sprinkled throughout the whole
college to make this community, um, what

it is, but it's a place of belonging.

It's a place of caring.

It's a place of learning.

And we really embrace, um, the fact
that we are all lifelong learners.

And so this isn't something that, you
know, you're just going to school for

you move on and you never think of
again, but how do you continue to learn

throughout your lifetime as you know,
and in, in a community, um, my title is,

uh, the director of learning in public.

And so when we think about
learning in public, usually people

don't like, Oh, what is that?

But it's, we learn.

Through lots of different things.

We learn through, um, thinking about
the ways that we've been able to, to

think about our health care system.

We learn through the ways of working
with libraries and working with people.

Um, we learn inside and
outside of the classroom.

But why does it only count
when it's inside the classroom?

And so we all have these lived experiences
that are very unique and there's a lot of

value and there's a lot of worth to that.

And I think that we don't honor people
enough in those different ways to

be like, wow, you really did that.

Like, that's amazing.

Um, and so it's a really,
um, a way for people to find.

Their voice to people, to find the
ways that they really want to be

in community with other people.

And, um, there's just so much
that you get and that you take

away from College Unbound.

As a student coming in, um, I, I
enrolled in College Unbound in 2019.

And, um, I had, you know, dropped out of.

High school in the 9th grade, got my
GED, um, went to community college for

a little while, got about 20 credits,
and then for the following 25 years,

worked as a community organizer doing all
types of, um, environmental and social

justice work, um, and public policy.

When I came to College Unbound,
my first thing was like, you

told me I got lived experience
and I could be able to use that.

And I was able to use that.

I was able to help, um, create
a program and a structure.

That's the program that I now oversee,
um, to figure out the ways to, um, look at

that lived experience, do a comprehensive
portfolio assessment on what was learned.

For And then be able to
bestow credit to students.

Um, it has been quite a journey for me.

Um, I fell in love for the 1st time
as an adult at College Unbound.

Um, I didn't really ever think that
education, um, was in my wheelhouse.

It just wasn't something
that I was good at.

I was a C and D student.

I barely passed.

Um, I really struggled in school.

And The first time I came to College
Unbound and I got an A, I was like, Oh

my gosh, I can do college level work.

And I was like, surprised myself.

Um, and then I realized, no,
this is something I can do.

It was, I think the learning pieces
and the way that we're able to

model and the way that we're able
to engage in the community, which

really helped me foster my learning.

Because there was a reason I wanted to
learn and there was something behind it.

It wasn't this arbitrary, you know,
go do a portfolio on elephants.

And what if I don't like elephants
and why do I have to do it?

I'm not going to get a
good grade, you know?

Um, but because it's really based
on your values and what you think

and what you want and the students
in the driver's seat, um, it's

been an unbelievable journey.

Hey.

I think you're being very modest,
by the way, I, I know a little bit

about your journey, so I'm going
to, we're going to dig deeper.

Okay, you can do that.

Right, but I also want to just really
quickly comment on a couple of things.

Um, I, I think it's important to
acknowledge that, The, the, the sort

of, you know, expected paths that people
have for children going from K 12 school

and then to college, spend a few years
in college, and then they go and get a

job, maybe go even get graduate degrees,
you know, and then get a job and then,

um, and then, uh, and then, uh, build
a family and then at some point retire.

This kind of, you know, picket fence,
you know, sort of dreamy, sort of,

um, you know, paths, they exist
for some people, but I think it

doesn't exist for millions of people.

I don't think that people realize
like, Oh, that's just the minority

that, that it doesn't work.

That's not true.

If we, I mean, even if
it is true, minority.

And for millions and millions,
there are still millions

and millions of them, right?

So it's a very large number of
people that it doesn't, and it has

to do with a little bit of that.

What you were saying, look, I
don't see a reason building a

portfolio on elephants, right?

Or to, to read a book about something
that you just didn't feel the

connection for, especially when.

Your life priorities have other things
going, maybe someone's sick in the family,

maybe you are responsible for taking care
of your children while, while being there.

And if in comparison, you know, I
get to spend time with my children or

I can go to this class, except that
this class is making me do things that

I'm not all that passionate about.

Man, that's hard day in and day out.

How could they spend years doing
that and complete that degree, right?

I think we look at, you know, not in any
way to not community colleges, but it

just, the way that they're structured.

Um, you know, when, when you go and
you, you apply to go to any school,

there's certain times, there's certain
classes, there's the maximum class

size, there's, you know, you have
these other things that come into play.

And if you're a working parent, right,
whether you're a single parent or not,

um, If you're a parent or you're working
40 hours and your kids are in school and

plus you're in school, there needs to be
a way to be able to find that balance.

And for a lot of colleges,
because it really is catered to

those 18 to 25 year olds, right?

Who couldn't work at night
and do these things, right?

When you've got a family and
you've got little ones that

just doesn't always work out.

Um, especially if you're
a single parent household.

And yeah.

It's a trade off.

It's, you know, do I work to put food on
my table or can I possibly take a class?

Like, and I don't really have
the time to invest in that.

And so I think College Unbound
is unique in the way that we only

have to, um, we only ask students
to show up in person once a week.

For 3 hours, and during that time
of those 3 hours, we also build

our community by breaking bread
together and having a communal meal.

Right?

We offer child care, um, on site so that,
uh, students can either come with their

cohort on either Tuesdays or Wednesdays.

But even if you're a Tuesday student,
you can come to school on Wednesday

and have your child in child
care while you're doing homework.

You know what I mean?

In another area of the building.

So, like, there's still that availability
because if you've got kids and you've got

homework to do, it's not always that easy.

Um, the way that we also structured it
in regards to the child care portion is

that, um, The students who are coming who
are kids, they get their homework done and

that's the first thing they have to do.

And so there's homework help, um,
so that parents are not necessarily

spending the time on that night because
they have their own classes to do.

And it really is nice to see the mix of
generations that come into the building.

Um, we've got husbands and wives
that are coming to school together.

We've got partners,
we've got best friends.

We have, um, a, uh, a mother,
a daughter and a granddaughter

all attending class together.

And it really is.

So it's not just, it's
first and second generation.

Um, sometimes third gen that we're seeing.

And it's a great model for the kids to
even come into the school building and

say, all right, mom or dad has got to go
to class and you're going to go to class

and you're going to do this and you're
going to have some fun stuff and arts and

crafts and whatever after your homework.

And by the way, we're also
going to provide your meal.

So people are not just driving from,
you know, their job to pick up their

kid, to get some fast food, right?

We also make sure that we have healthy
meals for people and it's great.

Like I will go in and I'll,
there's students that come in the

building and they're like, Oh, you
know, the traffic was horrible.

And I'm like, sit down.

What do you want?

I'll grab you a plate.

Let me bring you some water.

And students will look at me and be
like, seriously, you're doing this?

And I'm like, why not?

I'm already here.

Um, but it's a way just to
even, to appreciate them for

making the effort to come.

And then those other days of the week,
while they're not in, they're not in

that cohort class, all the other classes
they take are on Zoom so that there is

flexibility around, um, being able, like
I said, to be able to work, to be able to

maintain a family, to be able to maintain.

Your self care, right?

You don't want to just run out of
time and say, I have no time for me

because all I can do is work and study.

And this, I think is also, by the way,
what an amazing thing to have a brand

new college where you can invent these
new ways of just, I mean, think about

this ending the finances part, right?

Like some people might go,
well, what does it cost?

A hundred K a year to attend a school
where you provide feed free childcare?

No, but because it's two days, you are
able to limit it in those three hours.

You're able to do that and
provide them with food.

And guess what?

You also, they're not spending money
on a gym and on, you know, the swimming

pool, the, the, the, you know, the
other extravagant things that, you

know, some college campuses have, right.

Um, and you are able to
balance that out with.

You know, on things that
really are going to serve this

population of students better.

And, you know, also students every
eight weeks, um, there's an exhibition.

So students have to show their work,
uh, and they have to talk about, um, and

there's different ways that we model that.

And we have assignments, uh, so that
people can have their exhibitions.

But how great is it to be able
to present and then have your

kid give you feedback, right?

Or you bring in your family or
your friends or your coworkers so

they can see what you're doing.

Um, and they can see like,
yeah, just cause I'm in school.

I'm not just sitting in a classroom, like
listening to, you know, blah, blah, blah.

Like this is really hands on education.

Um, and because of that,
it feels different.

It feels like a place
that you want to come to.

Right.

And, um, it's, it's, you know, going
down that path of having, I think,

thinking about the ways that we
have, Like, a lot of adults have

been traumatized in education, right?

They're scared of that red pen
in the way that we just say,

oh, this isn't good enough.

Um, but that's not it.

And I think College Unbound is very
unique in the fact that because we're

not Um, extremely traditional and
we haven't been institutionaLizzed

with 100 year history, right?

We can come in and we can say what works
for us and what's happening in real

life right now and how we can, how can
we structure and make these adjustments

so we don't end up like that place.

Right?

Because we, we, we want people
to, um, feel like they have, they

have control and that they are
at the, the center of attention.

Um, and I think one of the ways
that we also do that is because we

also have one bachelor's degree.

And so that one bachelor's
degree, which is in organizational

leadership and change.

Um.

Is a great way to go.

One, you're not on a specific track
where you have to stay in this lane.

Organizational leadership and change.

It can ebb and flow and it's in
management and it's, you know,

you can use it for for profit.

You could use it in a nonprofit.

You could use it as, you know, a
startup as an entrepreneurship.

There are so many ways and,
and the degree is so versatile.

That you have opportunity to be able to
say, this is where I can think I can fit

in, in this type of field, and you're not
being held to a very like linear standard

of, you can only do this in this track.

I, I said before that we need to
dig into some of what you've done as

well, because it's an, an amazingly
impressive work that you've done and.

And for some, and I want people to hear
this probably also because for someone

as brilliant as you are, Lizz, you had,
like you said, education trauma in such

that 29 years after you attended school,
you get an A and you surprise yourself.

But if we look at your 29 years of
that career, which we're going to

go into, right, I think everyone's
going to be like, she's impressive.

How could she?

Be scared of not getting an A.

She's clearly an A material, right?

But I think we forget that students,
when they are young, when they

go through schools, these grades,
these feedback that they get, it

matters to these little brains.

They have nothing.

They have no way to defend themselves,
but by saying negative things to

themselves, to think that they
are less than capable, right?

Because someone said so, and
it could, it's so easy to give

someone a C and a D, like you said,
I'm a C and a D student, right?

It's so easy for them to fall into
that and then think less of themselves.

And that education trauma is real.

And I think that it's.

It's the kind of things that

most college, you know, have
admissions, you know, and it's It

further perpetuate that feeling and
that idea that you don't belong.

So when you said that we do these
projects and it's based on belonging

and care, purpose and mission gets
built and confidence get built.

Guess what?

People are more successful and
it, you'd wonder why, right?

You wonder why these people are like,
like you are saying, I found my place.

Well, no kidding, right?

Because you were traumatized, you were
young and you had no way to fight it.

You had to do it, right?

You were just told and you didn't
have a way to defend yourself and

you didn't fit into that mold.

And, and, uh, and so I think it's,
it's really, I mean, it's, it's an

incredibly amazing message, not only
for people who are interested in

college and back, but if you're in
a, if you're listening, you are in a.

K 12 school, you're in a college,
a more traditional college.

Think about these things, you know, and
how we continue that system with our

students and what that means for them.

As a, as a student, I mean, you
know, my, my glass ceiling was, I

want to get my bachelor's degree.

That was all I wanted.

I was like, if I'm going to get my
bachelor's degree, I've done all these

things in my life and that's all I want.

And then I got really close to
graduation at College Unbound

and I was in my capstone class
and I was like, but what do I do?

I don't want to leave.

How do I, how do I stay?

Like, can I take some more classes?

I know I'm supposed to graduate,
but I had this sense of like,

if I walk away, Now what?

And, and that was kind of scary
because all of a sudden I went from.

You know, just kind of working, but
then I went into this being of community

that was very much of belonging and I
was like, I don't, I like these people.

These are my people.

I want to stay and I
didn't want to graduate.

And I was scared to graduate because
I was like, what happens next?

Now what?

Um, and so two things happened.

Um, one, I fell in love with
education for the first time

in my life during this process.

And so I decided that I had
enough confidence and I enrolled

in Roger Williams University.

And I went to, um, took me another
15 months, but I got my master's

degree in community development.

And, um, It was a great experience
and you know, I ended up with a 4.

0 and it was something that I've
never, that I had never had.

I mean, that would happen
when I was in college.

I'm in my mid 40s at this point, right?

Going, I got an A for the first time.

What?

You think I could actually
handle a master's degree program?

I don't know.

And I did it.

And I was like, wow, I did it.

And I rocked it.

And it was really, really cool
to have that feeling of like, it

wasn't just me that couldn't learn.

Like there was something
else in those pieces.

And instead of, um, blaming myself, it
was like, well, now I understand why

education is, is like, you need to be
invested in it and you need to want it.

Um, And if you didn't have those happy
stories or you're able to kind of get

over that hump and be like, I did a
good job on this particular thing.

And it's always, you
didn't do good enough.

You should have get a C.

Why aren't you getting A's?

Um, there's always, you know,
red pen all over my paper

because I didn't do this right.

And I didn't meet your
specifications as a teacher.

Um, and, and that really
was, I think, had.

My issues with my lack of confidence
for years, that's how it was downplayed.

Um, and it was like, even working
in a nonprofit, you know, I remember

my executive director going, Oh,
well, maybe you should take a writing

course and maybe you should do this.

And I'm like, eh, no, I'm just me.

Um, So Lizz, tell us a little
bit after you had, had a, 20

credits from a community college.

You, um, was it around that time
where you started to venture out to

do other things and, and, um, tell us
about that because I, I think that's

an amazing story, what you then.

Yeah.

So, um, I came to College Unbound
and it was my third weekend.

And I was,

you know, told upon, you know,
doing the recruitment process and

coming in that, you know, you can
get up to, you know, a bunch of

credits for your lived experience.

And so I brought in a, WB Mason box
and had it filled with some stuff and

brought it to the provost and put it
on her desk and said, You said I could

get learned experience from stuff.

This is some of the stuff I've done.

Um, I worked for the
center for disease control.

Um, I was on the scientific
board of counselors.

I had, you know, done some work on Sesame
Street and was able to, um, be an advisor

on one of the segments for their content,
um, for lead poisoning prevention.

I, you know, had traveled all over the US.

I was key, a keynote speaker
at, at many, many conferences.

Um, you know, I, I had
just done a lot of types.

This is Lizz before, this is
Lizz before Lizz went to college,

did all of this without college.

I was a lobbyist for about 5 years.

Um, I worked on a significant
housing legislation, um, in

the state of Rhode Island.

Um, I was able to work with,
uh, the EPA on their renovation

and remodeling program.

Um, I was a, uh, an industrial hygienist
for the Rhode Island Department of

Health, uh, where I used to, to do lead
inspections and raid on the asbestos.

Um, there were a lot of different
things that I've done in my life.

And you thought you
were going to get an A.

You go to your first home.

But I had never gotten an A.

I had written grants.

Um, you know, I've, I've worked, uh,
on boards, um, you know, through,

through, you know, uh, different
types of boards and committees and

commissions and you name it for,
for years during my 29 year career.

And, um, yet I was extremely
intimidated and paranoid.

To go to school as an adult and at the
same time as I enrolled as an adult,

one of my sons, um, you know, was, was,
uh, also entering college, you know,

but, you know, he was 17, 18 at the
time and, uh, very different college.

You know, he lived on campus and
he, you know, he did that whole

college dorm thing and here I
am going, I'm in my mid forties.

I'm going to my first day of class.

I don't know what to expect.

I don't know if I can even pull this off.

Like, am I really doing the right thing?

Um, and so it was also really
interesting because during that time,

um, it was also during the pandemic.

And so I got to see, like, these nuances
of, like, college and traditional

life through my son's experiences.

And at the same time, I was all in You
know, um, full, you know, course load,

uh, and trying to do probably a lot more
than I should, um, But it was so new to

me and I just, I couldn't get enough.

Um, and then, so when I graduated college
on balance, um, I didn't want to leave.

And so one of the things I did was ask,
I was like, can I, can I get hired?

Can I work for you?

Like, I am totally transformed.

This, this school changed
the trajectory of my life.

It literally did that.

Um,

And so what, what are the next steps?

How do I stay connected?

And so I became, um, a teacher's
assistant and an alumni mentor, and I

started helping out in other cohorts.

And, uh, then I started working as,
uh, an recruit recruitment associate

because I totally believed in
the program and it worked for me.

I wanted everybody to have the
great experiences that I had.

Um, and so it was an easy thing to do.

It felt like an easy, I didn't have to
sell my, like sell something to somebody.

You're right.

I just had to tell them like, and
share the journey of education

and what you could get out of it.

Um, and that was a really big
deal for me, uh, in that role.

Because I wanted everybody to have
the great experience that I had.

And, uh, once I was able to do that,
and then I, um, after that got my

master's degree, then I moved, uh, I
kind of moved up, uh, the provost who I

had brought my big box to, um, in that
initial three weeks, uh, was leaving and

I was asked to take over her position.

And so that's how I became the
director of learning in public.

Um, Knowing that for the last four
years that we have operated, um, for

learning in public, which is, um, Our
version of CPL, so credit for prior

learning or, or, um, prior learning
assessments are done throughout, you

know, institutions all over the U.

S.

Um, but we decided not to use those
names because it's not just what

you've done prior and it's not just.

The things, um, that you've done
in your past, but it's also what

are you doing now and what are
you looking to do in the future?

And that's why we have come up
with the name of Learning in

Public, because it really is.

Right, you can learn anywhere.

You can learn through your home.

You can learn online, right?

You can learn in school.

You can learn at the doctor's office.

You can learn in the library.

Here's a preview of what's
coming up next in part two of

my conversation with Lizz Colon.

Learn Director of Learning
in Public at College of Bell.